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 Help!on spiral inductor modeling! 

Last post Tue, Aug 11 2009 6:09 PM by Peakview. 10 replies.
Started by tjjbraye 07 Jul 2009 06:13 AM. Topic has 10 replies and 9791 views
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  • Tue, Jul 7 2009 6:13 AM

    • tjjbraye
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    • Joined on Tue, Jul 7 2009
    • Posts 7
    • Points 155
    Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply
    Hi every buddy,

    I'm using VPCM from MMSIM61 in IC610 platform for modeling  spiral inductor .After generating cell,I could only open layout view.But I can't open any other view such as symbol,schematic.In the CIW prompt window,it gives the following warning:
    *WARNING* dbOpenCellViewByType: Design database revision (59) is not compatible with current revision (99).

    So what 's wrong with me?
    My component type is differential inductor and shape is octagonal with 2 ports.
    Accuracy selection:Full-Wave EM Solver.
    Please,anybody can help mee!
    Thank you in advance!
    • Post Points: 20
  • Tue, Jul 7 2009 8:11 AM

    • tkhan
    • Top 50 Contributor
    • Joined on Sat, Aug 16 2008
    • Toronto, Ontario
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    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply

     Maybe it is related to the database format? I'm not sure if MMSIM61/VPCD will save to OA format, since it is quite old maybe it still uses CDBA. Have you tried a newer version of MMSIM? Or an older version of IC? I use IC5141 and MMSIM62 and I have no problems with the cells generated by VPCD.

    • Post Points: 20
  • Tue, Jul 7 2009 6:13 PM

    • tjjbraye
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    • Points 155
    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply
    thanks foy your reply, but the generated layout cell view is valid, and I can open it.In the layout view directory,there are 2 files:layout.oa and master.tag.In other cell view directory(symbol,schematic,etc):there are 3 files:dd.db,master.tag and symbol.oa. So there is diffrence between layout view directory and other view directory.And may it be the problem? I will try other version .like mmsim62 to see if it's the database problem. thanks!
    • Post Points: 20
  • Wed, Jul 8 2009 12:34 AM

    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply

    What IC version are you using? (what does "virtuoso -W" output?). The currently supported IC6 release is IC613, and the currently supported MMSIM versions are MMSIM70 and MMSIM71.

    I should also point out that VPCD has been end-of-lifed before Christmas...

    Regards,

    Andrew.

    • Post Points: 20
  • Wed, Jul 8 2009 12:59 AM

    • tjjbraye
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    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply
    To Andrew, I'm a fresh in the domain of inductor modeling.As you mentioned VPCD has been EOLed before Christnas,what shold I use to model a inductor in a quick way when I 'm a new fish in this field. Below gives the version info. Thanks,buddy! [tjj@localhost ~]$ virtuoso -W sub-version IC6.1.0.243
    • Post Points: 20
  • Wed, Jul 8 2009 1:08 AM

    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply

    Well, for a start, you're using the IC610 base release - I would suggest you move to something newer - there have been a lot of changes since then.

    Cadence no longer provides any inductor synthesis or analysis tools - you should look at our connections partners  http://www.cadence.com/Alliances/connections/pages/default.aspx for more details.

    Regards,

    Andrew.

    • Post Points: 20
  • Wed, Jul 8 2009 5:54 PM

    • tjjbraye
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    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply
    Thanks buddy, I may choose some other tools to do inductor modeling,like ASITIC.
    • Post Points: 50
  • Wed, Jul 8 2009 6:36 PM

    • tkhan
    • Top 50 Contributor
    • Joined on Sat, Aug 16 2008
    • Toronto, Ontario
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    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply

    you are aware that ASITIC hasn't been updated since 2002 right? in my experience, asitic doesn't produce DRC legal layouts, mainly due to the angles for the traces and crossovers, and the placement of vias causing KCL violations. i think your best bet would be to get VPCD working and verify the results with an EM solver such as RFDE Momentum. If the results vary significantly you can generate the spice model from momentum and use that for your simulation. I posted a comparision of ASITIC and PCD on another forum a while back, I'll repost the results here:

    images: http://yfrog.com/0xasiticjx 

    W=15um
    S=5um
    N=5
    Dout=310um

    PCD reports L=5.866n, Q=13.87 @ 1GHz, SRF=6.5GHz
    ASITIC reports L=5.376n, Q=12.62 @ 1GHz, SRF=7.8GHz  

    • Post Points: 20
  • Wed, Jul 8 2009 10:47 PM

    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply
    Agreed. You should be able to get this working now, but I was just trying to avoid you building any long term flows on an EOLed tool.

    The messages you're getting suggest an incompatibility in OpenAccess versions - I think the trouble is that you're using too old an IC version, and consequently you're trying to open some library cellViews built with a newer version.

    If you update the IC version to IC613, you should be OK.

    Note that there was a database revision between IC611 and IC612 which means that once you've moved. You can't go back. But that should not in practice be a problem, except it means that all users looking at whatever database you're producing will need to be using IC612 or later.

    Regards,

    Andrew
    • Post Points: 5
  • Wed, Jul 15 2009 1:35 AM

    • Frank Wiedmann
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    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply

    Regarding the EM solver, you might want to take a look at the free Sonnet Lite (http://www.sonnetsoftware.com/products/lite/).

    • Post Points: 5
  • Tue, Aug 11 2009 6:09 PM

    • Peakview
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    Re: Help!on spiral inductor modeling! Reply

    Check out PeakView from Lorentz Solution (www.lorentzsolution.com).  It is fully integrated in Cadence Virtuoso Environment that provides inductor synthesis, layout generation and RLCK modeling that is fully Spectre compliant.   

    • Post Points: 5
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Started by tjjbraye at 07 Jul 2009 06:13 AM. Topic has 10 replies.